A brand that resonates is vital if you or your company hopes to succeed in a fast-moving digital environment. While many companies focus on their capital B brand, it is also imperative that we keep an eye on our personal brand. Join Can You Hear Me? Co-hosts Rob Johnson and Eileen Rochford welcome Paige Arnof-Fenn, founder and CEO of Mavens and Moguls, as they discuss “Personal Branding in a Digital World.”
Paige Arnof-Fenn is the founder & CEO of global branding and digital marketing firm Mavens & Moguls based in Cambridge, MA. Her clients include Microsoft, Virgin, The New York Times Company, Colgate, venture-backed startups as well as non profit organizations. She graduated from Stanford University and Harvard Business School. Paige serves on several Boards, is a popular speaker and columnist who has written for Entrepreneur and Forbes.
Eileen Rochford: [00:00:16] Hello, everybody, and welcome to another Can You Hear Me? podcast episode. I'm Eileen Rochford, CEO of The Harbinger Group, a marketing and strategy firm. [00:00:25][8.7]
Rob Johnson: [00:00:25] and I'm Rob Johnson, president of Rob Johnson Communications. Here on Can You Hear Me, we love talking about brands, whether it's the company's brand or even your own brand. Today, we're welcoming someone who knows all about that topic. She is Paige Arnof-Fenn, the founder and CEO of Mavins & Moguls, a global strategic marketing firm. Paige, thank you so much for joining us today. We can't wait to dive in on all of the great things we're going to talk about today. [00:00:49][23.8]
Paige Arnof-Fenn: [00:00:49] Well, thank you all for having me. I'm excited to jump in. [00:00:52][2.7]
Eileen Rochford: [00:00:52] Fantastic. So, Paige, we're ready and we're going to dive into our main discussion today on brand. We're going get there. But in a second, because before we do that, why don't you give our listeners just a bit of background of maybe a short version of your origin story is very impressive and extensive. [00:01:11][18.9]
Paige Arnof-Fenn: [00:01:12] Well, I guess I got into marketing through a circuitous route, not even the back door, just, you know, I was an econ major in college. My dad and both grandfathers were commercial bankers, so I always thought I was going to get into banking. And it was the 80s when I graduated from college. Michael Douglas had just won the Oscar for the first Wall Street movie. I went and saw it and got completely enamored and decided to do a very popular, well-worn route. and I went to Wall Street for two years after college. And it was a wild ride, super crazy, but I realized pretty quickly that that was not gonna be my career path. But I had made a two-year commitment and I was gonna be good to my word, but I decided I needed to apply. to business school, get an MBA and kind of rebrand myself. So that was my first foray into personal branding because I had always been the kind of finance person that was gonna do banking. A girlfriend of mine who I met at the bank, she and I traveled in Europe. the summer between working and business school. We were both going back for MBAs and we were lying on a beach in Europe and she said, you know, are you going back to the bank? And I said, no way in hell. I just, that was tough two years and I'm done. And she's like, how can you say that? You were so good at it. You had to have loved it. I said I didn't love it at all. I really didn't like it and she was going to go back into finance, she was hooked and she said, there has to be something you liked about that job because you couldn't have done it that well for two years if you hated it. And I said, well, there are actually three things about the job that I loved, but pretty much everything else I couldn't stand. She said, what did you love? And I say, well as soon as the transaction closed, whether we were buying or selling or merging, whatever the raising money. because I was the junior person on the team right out of college, it was my job to work with the Wall Street Journal and the New York Times to run what was called the Tombstone ad where you kind of let everybody know our bank led the transaction, here's what happened. So I loved working with the newspapers to get that done. And then I got to plan a closing dinner to celebrate the end of the deal. And at the dinner, I got to present everybody with like a deal toy, some promotional item that commemorated, you know, the fun that we had together. My girlfriend shook her head. She said, Paige, I don't know why you think you're a finance person. The things you like about the job are not finance. They're marketing. Everything you like doing. Advertising, event planning, promotionals. That's all marketing. I said, I've never taken a marketing class in my life. I don t even know what marketing is. Is that a job? She's like, you're gonna take marketing in business school. I bet you you're going to love it. Well, she was completely right. It was a required course our first year. I got the top grade in the class. I was asked to be a tutor for students taking marketing the next year. I became president of the marketing club and she was right. I got a summer internship at Procter & Gamble, the biggest marketing company in the world, and I've been in marketing ever since. I think maybe sometimes you're so close to it and you don't even realize, but other people can help you see where you're strong and where your natural talents lie. So I literally got into it, not even realizing what I was doing, to be totally honest. [00:04:38][206.1]
Rob Johnson: [00:04:39] So, but your journey since then has been very interesting, and you and Eileen have a lot of similarities, I think, in your journey. So why don't you kind of walk people through, you know, the path that brought you to where you are now at Mavens and Mogul. [00:04:55][16.1]
Paige Arnof-Fenn: [00:04:55] Yep. So I look at my marketing career in kind of three chapters. The first chapter was the big fortune 500 CPG, you know, big consumer products, companies, uh, brand management at P and G and assistant chief marketing officer at Coca-Cola. So well-recognized brands, they are, you know, P and J is in a ton of different categories. Every category they're in, they're the top. number one and sometimes also number two brand in that category. So they invented the concept of brand management, running your brand like a business and a lot of their brands are like, you know, bajillion dollar brands, Tide detergent, press toothpaste, Pampers, Sherman, Bounty, uh, Pantene, oil of Olay. So I got really good training, uh from, you know. big consumer products companies, well-loved brands. Coke is sold in over 200 countries around the world. You give somebody your business card when you go work for a business like that, they're immediately impressed. They know the company. That was like my foundational chapter in marketing. Then in the mid to late 90s, the internet started taking off and it was like a shiny object I could not take my eyes off of. So i left my big corporate job at coke and joined a company no one had ever heard of. It was a venture-backed startup in the music and entertainment space. And, you know, I think my boss, my mother, I think everyone who knew me thought I was having a nervous breakdown. Like, who leaves a job like Coca-Cola to go work for a company no one's ever heard of before? But I just I felt like I had to get it out of my system. It was the shiny object I couldn't take my eyes off of. Well, in about a year and a half, we went public. We were sold the Yahoo. My husband got a job. I was living in LA at that time. He got a job in Boston. So we moved cross-country. I did another startup as the head of marketing. About a year and a half later, it got sold to the largest privately held media company in the world. I didn't another startup is the head of marketing and they went public and were sold. I got hooked. It was fast paced, it was really fun, much smaller budgets. I got very good at guerrilla marketing, working with not a lot of money, but it was so much fun and none of the hierarchy and structure of the big corporate marketing jobs. So that was like my second chapter and then 9-11 hit and y'all are probably old enough to remember. A lot of people weren't kind of in the game at that point, but when 9- 11 happened, and the stock market dropped hundreds of points, which it does now like every day and people don't even blink, but back then it was very stressful. and every company decided they were going to freeze their marketing budgets, lay off the marketing department, because they wanted to conserve cash. And I had just gotten bought out of the third startup, so I didn't need to work. But I was young, I was only in my 30s. And I realized I really wanted to keep doing it. And all these companies had laid off marketing, but they still needed marketing help. So a lot of the venture capitalists and private equity guys, classmates from business school, people reached out and said, Hey, can you help us? You know what you're doing. And my first reaction was, you know, I'm not really a consultant. I never worked on the agency side. I'm the client, but they needed like an agency or a consultant to help. And my husband's like, Paige, there's a big red flashing sign in front of you. These people need your help. You know what? You're doing go do it. And so I started calling all my favorite marketing people from earlier in my career. Everybody had just been laid off. They were all I had people I had projects and I put them together and so I called the women the marketing mavens and the guys the marketing moguls and we've been doing it ever since that was 23 years ago, so Crazy. I never, I never wrote a business plan. I never expected to be working for myself so much longer than I ever worked for anybody else. But here we are. [00:08:58][243.3]
Eileen Rochford: [00:08:59] Yeah, congratulations, that's fantastic. Crazy. All fun. [00:09:02][3.2]
Rob Johnson: [00:09:02] So, marketing and branding, I mean, it's just, they're such catch-alls, right? And they're huge topics to discuss. But today, we really want to focus on personal branding. It can be a real challenge in today's vast and immediate digital world. How did you start to focus on the people's brands and where do you think they should be positioned? [00:09:21][19.1]
Paige Arnof-Fenn: [00:09:22] So the world has changed so much. When y'all and I started, there was radio, television, print and outdoor. Those were the line items on the marketing budget. There was no internet, there was no streaming, there is no cable. It was a very limited option of how to get the word out. You could do direct mail, you could do phone, but there weren't all the myriad of that we have today. And because we're all walking around with these phones in our pocket, it's, you know, the technology today is everywhere and it follows us everywhere. So I think one of the challenges is, you now, people... And maybe you see this in your line of work as well, where people say like, I'm not LeBron James, I'm Taylor Swift, I am not Beyonce, I'm really a brand, like I'm famous. You know, I just own this small business or I just work at this big company. But you can't really say that anymore. And I think if we learned anything during COVID. everybody is a brand today and before you meet with someone, before you agree to grab lunch or coffee or be on a podcast, people are going to check you out. They're going to go into Google, put your name in, they're going look on LinkedIn. Who is this person? Do I need to return the call? Is it worth spending an hour at lunch with them? You got to see what pops up. whether or not you decide you want to, you know, invest your time and blood, sweat and tears into this relationship, it really is a question of like, is this a brand that you want to invest in? And that's just a reality today. And, you know, when the pandemic hit and, you know, we the brick and mortar world kind of died, everything kind of shut down, we were living our lives online. And so if you don't exist online today, you don't exist. And it doesn't matter if you're like, you know, Rob's got his name in his company. Eileen does not, I do not, but we are all very connected to our company brands. And when people look up your company, whether your name's on the door or not, they're going to associate that brand with you. And so you really do need to. you know, I hope by the end of our conversation today, the listeners will see that, you know your brand really matters and you don't have to be Beyonce to be a brand today. [00:12:01][159.2]
Eileen Rochford: [00:12:02] Absolutely. I just had a similar experience of looking up folks before meeting with them last week and was surprised because it was as if they hadn't posted in 8, 9, 10 months and their following was kind of smaller. But, and they didn't respond when I sent message, you know, kind of like, oh, excited about blah, blah, blah. But when I was having the discussion with them. They were noting all kinds of things that they could only have picked up by looking at my profile on LinkedIn. [00:12:33][30.7]
Paige Arnof-Fenn: [00:12:34] But they didn't make the calculation that you might have been doing the same thing about them. [00:12:38][4.0]
Eileen Rochford: [00:12:38] Maybe not, I don't know, but it was kind of interesting. [00:12:41][2.8]
Rob Johnson: [00:12:41] They should have known Eileen was gonna check that out. Yeah, come on. [00:12:44][2.5]
Paige Arnof-Fenn: [00:12:43] I mean, it's such an interesting thing, though, because with a name like mine, with a name like yours, if you Google us, you're probably going to find us you're you know, if you know the names of our companies with Rob, you know it's a more common name. And so you might have to do a little bit of extra digging to make sure you got the right one. [00:13:09][25.6]
Rob Johnson: [00:13:10] The only reason I did mine, Rob Johnson Communications, is I was taking advice from smart people like Eileen as I transitioned out of TVs because I did TV and because I had a really well-known brand in Chicago, which I'm obviously trying to expand nationally, but I was like, well, that's a good start. That's something that I have that other people don't have, even though it's a common name, but so that was kind of, as I sat there and thought about the branding of what I did, I didn't have to put my name in it and it wasn't like some sort like a vanity thing. It was just, well, people know me and they'll be like, oh, the TV guy, you know, and now I'm the communicator guy, I hope. [00:13:44][33.9]
Paige Arnof-Fenn: [00:13:44] But that's super smart. That is how you get recognized. That's how you stand out. But I think there are a lot of people that, and we can get into this, there are a lot challenges when people don't take their online presence seriously because they are going to create problems for themselves because we live in a digital world today. And again, if you don't exist online or if people can't find you, or there's some confusion, you know, are you the serial killer with that? Are you the porn star with that nickname? Are you, you know, like, careful because... people to be confused as to like, I am the professional, I have a really good reputation, here is how I have impact, and you want them to get there as quickly as possible, so they return the phone call so that you know that you're connected to the right people. [00:14:40][55.8]
Eileen Rochford: [00:14:41] Yeah, I like I love how you put that. Take your digital presence seriously. That's an awesome takeaway from from this part of our chat. Do you let's move on to this question that I have, which is you since this is where you kind of you live page, what is the most significant barrier that you see for people to get on to particularly the professional social networking platform LinkedIn? What's the barrier? What's holding them back? [00:15:07][25.9]
Paige Arnof-Fenn: [00:15:07] So, you need to take your LinkedIn profile seriously. You get one chance to make a great first impression and so you don't wanna blow it. Have a good headshot, attractive, professional, fill out the summary, get some people to write nice things about you, be thorough in the places that you worked, what you achieved. As you said, having activity, um showing that you kind of know how to leverage the the platform um a really simple thing that you should do if you notice it tells you how many connections the person has um you need to get to the number 500 because once you get to 500 it's 500 plus but if you only have 283 connections and you're out there acting like you're a very well connected well respected networked person and you only have 283 connections, it raises more questions. Like, what is wrong with this person? How can they not have 500 plus? You know, that does not make sense. You want it to be a good reflection of you, of your strengths, of your professionalism. LinkedIn's also a great platform for thought leadership. If you're writing articles, if you see things that you think are useful and interesting and you have an opinion on them, you can post it, you can share it. If you can draft your own articles, If you're speaking at an event, you can let people know. When people Google you, LinkedIn is one of the very first things that pops up. So again, if there's any confusion at all, a lot of people with common names put their LinkedIn profile and their signature on their email so people immediately can find them. So LinkedIn is more than a resume or a Rolodex. um it is the foundation for building great relationships in a digital economy so it's a good starting point and you don't have to wait for in-person networking to do networking on linkedin it's a great platform for you can search in an advanced way to find people at a particular company if you're going to a conference and they give you the list in advance of people you're um that have also registered you can look people up if you've going to meetings with people. You can check people out. You see what contacts you have in common. The thing that you don't know is the strength of those connections. All three of us know a lot of people in common, but we don't, was it my college roommate? Is it the former boss? Is it someone that I traded business cards with for five minutes at a networking event three years ago that I couldn't pick out of a police lineup? You don't know that, but it could be a kid that I grew up with who I've known for 50 years. So it's a good conversation starter. LinkedIn, I think, especially in B2B, in sales, in professional services, LinkedIn is far and away, I think the most important platform. [00:18:12][184.4]
Eileen Rochford: [00:18:13] Mm-hmm. Bob, do you mind if I jump in with the follow-up? [00:18:15][2.0]
Rob Johnson: [00:18:16] Absolutely. [00:18:16][0.0]
Eileen Rochford: [00:18:17] All right, super quick. So recently I had two examples, a person who has been working longer than I have and is pretty accomplished in their field. And when I went to check out their profile, I was a little stunned by how they had maybe 400 followers or connections. And I just thought, wow, how can that be, you know, in this day and age? And then I've also had increasingly in Rob's experiencing this too, and maybe you are too, Paige. It's that time of year where we're being inundated from ambitious. young folks who maybe are in college looking for internships, perhaps looking to be graduated, graduate soon, you know, in our field. And so I'm seeing a lot of activity on LinkedIn, because if I get a request from someone, I go and look at them on LinkedIn just like you said. So, and these young folks, they're doing a really good job. Many colleges are really kind of leaning on this and for the day they walk in the door, hey, let's start building that LinkedIn profile. However, I do see a fair amount who aren't, who should be. So what I'm asking is, for both ends of the spectrum, what would you tell these people and how can they kind of get over this and get out there? [00:19:19][61.9]
Paige Arnof-Fenn: [00:19:19] So number one, clean up your digital dirt. If you, if you Google yourself and stuff comes up, it's not flattering. You need to start generating a lot of good content. That's going to press that bad stuff down. And for these new graduates, that's going to be really important if you've been blogging or you've been putting up a lot of stuff, a lot of content that doesn't either put you in a great light, or maybe the content is controversial in some way. it's political, it's, you know, you gotta be super careful about that because that is gonna be something that recruiters and interviewers are gonna be seeing. So be super-careful. And yeah, if you're a more senior-level person and you seem kind of tone-deaf or out of touch, you don't take the platform seriously because you think, you now, I'm old, everybody knows me, I don't really need to put that much into the, you know, I don't really like investing that much time, it's a waste of time. What you're doing is you're basically signaling and it's not that you're a Luddite, but you're just not staying fresh and current with the technology. And you know people are going to be searching by keywords by and if you don't know, you know what the latest and greatest is, you're not going to come up in those searches and people are gonna think you're you know it's like a milk carton with expiration date and it looks like you're kind of expired like do you know? that cybersecurity and artificial intelligence are kind of what people are talking about now. And if you don't look like you've got any of the current skills, if you're not talking about any of that, you're connected to any of that. People are going to question whether or not your skills are still relevant. Has life passed you by? So I think at both ends of the spectrum, very junior and very senior, it is really important to show that you care, that you're current, that you're kind of up to speed on what are the things that people look for? What do they care about? What are they want to talk about today? Because otherwise you're not going to be part of the conversation and you're going to not be considered for those interviews, those jobs or, you know, someone senior to go speak at a conference, to be a keynote. You know, if you don't look like you're staying up with the times, no one's going to want to opinion on it thing. [00:21:43][143.9]
Rob Johnson: [00:21:43] And speaking of the milk carton, you don't want to be so invisible that somebody would have to put you on a milk cartons. So that's the other milk cart. [00:21:50][6.4]
Eileen Rochford: [00:21:50] Another reference to our youth right there. [00:21:53][2.6]
Rob Johnson: [00:21:53] There. That's right. Showing my age. Absolutely. So let's move on to AI. Eileen and I love talking about AI. But in this particular exercise today, I'm really interested about how people think AI, okay, if I'm going to convey information about myself, I am just going to throw it in chat GPT and it's going to spit out something and that sort of thing. I think on this podcast, we have explained enough times how it's a great tool, but it still needs the human touch. But what is your cautionary tale about the use of generative AI when you're trying to sell yourself and say, oh, I need a little help from artificial intelligence? [00:22:29][35.7]
Paige Arnof-Fenn: [00:22:29] So a little help's okay. It's great for brainstorming, it's great to kind of get stuff out there as a stake in the ground. But what really matters is showing your humanity, telling your war stories. You know, Eileen started with like, Paige, tell me your origin story. That is something that only I can tell. That is that you can't generate generically in a, you know. box where you say, you know, where did you come from? You know, tell me, tell [00:23:00][30.4]
Rob Johnson: [00:23:00] What they would say though tell me about my background [00:23:04][3.2]
Paige Arnof-Fenn: [00:23:05] But, you know, people want to hear the good, the bad, the ugly. They want those war stories. They want to here, you now, the vulnerabilities, the stories that only a human can tell. And so what I tell my clients is the AI that matters today more than anything are authentic interactions. That's really what I want people to focus because that's really where you show your strengths, your challenges, where you came from. And that's what people hook into. That's what they remember. The facts, the figures, the data, it all starts to blur together. But if you tell them a story that touches them emotionally and connects with them on a human level, that's where you stand out. And a brand is a promise of a consistent experience. It's real estate that you own in your customer or client's brain. So when they have a problem that your product or service can help them solve they think of you first and you know That, you know, the artificial intelligence is kind of secondary behind the real human side of your story, because unfortunately, they're just, if you look at people's websites in any category, and you took out their company name, would you know it was them? Do you understand that like, what is their culture? What is their special sauce? What, what do they do that's different than their competitors? And, you know, you think about it with, with, um, brands, uh, and so why wouldn't you think of it with people as well, but like, if I blindfolded you and put you on an airplane and you were sitting there. you know, if you were on a lot of different airlines, you probably wouldn't know the difference. But I bet you if you are on a Southwest airline, just the way the stewardesses and attendants talk on the microphone when they do the normal, you know safety things, they do it with a twist. There's a lot more personality. There's lot more human, you now, joking and you know it really comes through in a different way. So, you know, there are a lot of companies that do what all of us do in marketing and communication. So if your personality is not coming through in your website, in your interactions, you're really missing an opportunity, you do not want to be a sea of sameness out there. And I think when people overly rely on all these AI tools, and it doesn't matter if it's chat, GPT, perplexity, Claude. All of them are gonna come up with the same generic hashtags and buzzwords, and that's not really where the action is. You wanna have real conversations without jargon with stories that only you can tell because that's where you're gonna break through and make those connections. [00:25:58][173.7]
Eileen Rochford: [00:26:00] Here, here. All right. Okay. One more question. It's about, I think we have just enough time to dig into one more topic. Okay, here's what it is. So it can be really frustrating when you're putting in the time and you're posting regularly or doing the things that you're supposed to do, but you're not gaining any traction. What mistakes have you seen people do when they get to that frustration level that we want to make sure our listeners No, don't do that. [00:26:26][26.8]
Paige Arnof-Fenn: [00:26:27] So, you know, there are a lot of platforms out there and there are new ones popping up all the time and I think one of the biggest mistakes you see is people spreading themselves too thin. They're trying to be everywhere and they're trying to say everything to everybody everywhere and that's really not a good strategy. I think you need to pick your platform and pick two. that you like, that are authentic to you, that really showcase your strengths in the very best way and be really visible on those and make that your primary hook. So for me, it's absolutely LinkedIn. My clients are not looking for me on X or Facebook or Instagram, that's not where people are gonna look to find me and my service. So LinkedIn is my kind of platform of choice and I don't even worry about the others. Uh, you know, people say to me, should I be blogging? Well, do you like to blog? Do you have something to say on a regular basis? Is that a good way to showcase your strengths? What, what happens is people set up a blog and the first week they post three times and they're so excited. And the second week, they're a little busier. They only do it once, but they haven't even gone back to check and see if anybody's commented. The third week they're on the road for work and they're at a conference and they are traveling. Next week they come back, they're buried, they are getting caught up. They post one more time, but it's very short. So what have you done? You've basically told your audience, I'm kind of flaky, you can't count on me. You know, I am not going to be that serious. Think about how you're diluting your brand. So instead of just starting a blog and thinking you need to put yourself out there, I always tell people, start with other well-trafficked blogs in your category or industry. Who are the people that already have an audience, that already the traffic that are blogging in a professional way on a regular basis. You can check in on their blog on your schedule and you can comment and make really smart posts and get to be known as like a voice of reason on a well-trafficked blog that's already well respected. And when you do that and you put your signature at the bottom of all your posts, all of a sudden people say, you know, every time Eileen posts something, I agree with her, or Rob is so smart, he has such great experience. And then they follow your signature and they go to your site and they see how you're doing. And they go, you know? I have a problem. I think I should follow up with them because they seem to really get this in a way that most people don't. So you're building your brand and you're your reputation. The same thing, you know. If you're trying to be really professional on LinkedIn and then on Facebook, you're posting like vacation pictures and you're out with your college buddies and you know you're on the beach in a bikini and you are doing some glamor shots and then on X you want to be humorous but you're more snarky. Okay, so now I found you on five different platforms and I have no idea which version of you is going to show up at the meeting and you know who are you going to invite to be on your podcast? What have said? partier or that snarky person shows up and that's not really the image that you want to, you know, portray as someone that you wanna spend that time with. So be deliberate, be intentional, and make sure you're reinforcing the messages that really matter to your business. And so I would just caution people, you don't need to be everywhere. Be consistent where you do pop up and just be very thoughtful about the image that you're putting out there because people see everything. Like I said if they google you a lot of stuff's going to come up and you want to make sure it's the right stuff. So fire beware. [00:30:19][232.8]
Rob Johnson: [00:30:21] Alright, that's... [00:30:21][0.5]
Eileen Rochford: [00:30:22] You made a really good point in there that I just want to draw out, which was the pay attention to other people relevant to your areas of expertise who have large followings and engage with their content. I could not agree more. And I have a very recent example that is, it's small scale, but it really illustrates what you're talking about. There was a person who talks about remote work and how to do it effectively. And they have a pretty large following, it was pretty significant. and they put up a post last week that was just so related to the experience that we've had with our remote company for 23 years that I instantly had something. know, to contribute to say, you know, that it doesn't work for everybody straight up. But here's why it works and makes sense for our organization and has for 23 years, because their post was kind of predicated on the whole people going remote, the during COVID, etc. And how now it's viewed as having to go backwards, etc.. And so I just chimed in with my experience. That's it was four sentences. Now I post pretty regularly, probably three, four days a week. And I'm working on increasing the engagement with specific posts for sure. But in an hour, there were 45 people who had basically pressed like on a single comment that I made on someone else's. And then beyond that, there were the views to my profile skyrocketed that day. [00:31:47][85.6]
Paige Arnof-Fenn: [00:31:47] If you check your Google Analytics, they all went back to your website because they said, that woman's smart. She raised a really smart point and then all of a sudden your capital is increasing. [00:31:58][10.5]
Eileen Rochford: [00:31:59] So I appreciate that you brought that up, but I thought I would just underscore. [00:32:02][2.7]
Paige Arnof-Fenn: [00:32:03] No, it's a perfect example, absolutely perfect. [00:32:05][2.3]
Rob Johnson: [00:32:06] Absolutely. All right, before we leave, and I know in our show notes, we're going to leave contact information and other relevant information about you, Page. I know there's a lot that we were diving into here. But as you leave, as we leave this conversation on the personal branding front, what kind of parting wisdom do you have to share with everybody? [00:32:22][16.2]
Paige Arnof-Fenn: [00:32:23] So I just, I hope we have convinced all your listeners that it's real, it matters. And when you make good connections with people that are simpatico, you have the same values, your mission, your vision, you know, you have a lot of overlap. Connect with them on LinkedIn, you know. Everything communicates who you're connected to, what you're what you are talking about on all these platforms, how you look, what you drive, all those things communicate and they're all part of your personal brand. And if you say you're... very buttoned up and professional and people see you in the grocery store or on the soccer field and you look like a hot mess. That you know it's like remember the early days of COVID when we were all on zoom and some people were doing zoom meetings like in their bedroom the The bed was not made, it was, you know, you can't unsee that once it's bigger. [00:33:19][56.6]
Eileen Rochford: [00:33:20] I still have nightmares. [00:33:21][1.1]
Paige Arnof-Fenn: [00:33:23] You still have these visions and it's like people need to take it seriously, you know, everything communicates. So I would just hope that we've been able to just make a solid case so that people are are really putting their best face forward. And like I said, you get one chance to make a great first impression, it's going to cost a lot of money and take a lot more time to get them to come back. So make every encounter matter and realize that everything you say and do communicates. So, you know, think about the brand and the impression you want to make and make sure everything you're doing reinforces that. [00:34:01][38.4]
Rob Johnson: [00:34:02] You're here. [00:34:02][0.2]
Eileen Rochford: [00:34:02] Absolutely. I can't wait to see more people on LinkedIn. All thanks to you, Paige. Well done. That was just terrific. We really appreciate you being on with us today. And that's going to do it for the latest episode of Can You Hear Me? I'm Eileen Rochford. And if any of our listeners, YouTube page would like to jump on to our LinkedIn page and tell us ideas that you'd like us to talk about in the future, we would love to hear from you. [00:34:27][25.0]
Rob Johnson: [00:34:28] I think that's how Page, we got to Page it, a connection and then like, hey Rob, how you doing? So that worked out perfectly in this instance. And I'm Rob Johnson. We do thank you for listening. If you like the show, please consider giving us a review on any of the platforms where you can find Can You Hear Me, Apple, Spotify, and much more. Your reviews help other potential listeners find our show. Thanks a lot. [00:34:48][20.7]
Paige Arnof-Fenn: [00:34:48] Thank y'all. [00:34:48][0.0]
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