Gone are the days of screaming at employees to do their jobs and work harder. Today’s business leader needs to understand the current work environment should include helpings of kindness and compassion. In this episode of “Can You Hear Me?”, with the season of Thanksgiving upon us, co-hosts Eileen Rochford and Rob Johnson explore the power of “Expressing Gratitude at Work.”
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Eileen Rochford [00:00:18] Hello again, everyone. I'm Eileen Rochford, CEO of the marketing and strategy firm The Harbinger Group.
Rob Johnson [00:00:24] And I'm Rob Johnson, president of Rob Johnson Communications. You know, if you listen to this podcast with any regularity, we are big on leaders making sure they are tending to all of the needs of their employees, including mental health and a sense of belonging. The hard driving pedal to the metal win at all costs and do your job boss has been replaced by those more collaborative, more inclusive, and more aware of what's going on around them in relation to their workers. Did you know that 79% of employees will quit due to lack of appreciation? That number is from our friend and former Can You Hear Me? guest Megan Robinson of E Leader Experience.
Eileen Rochford [00:01:03] Oh, my God. That's so sobering. Thank you again. Wow. That kind of puts a fine point on this conversation.
Rob Johnson [00:01:08] It does.
Eileen Rochford [00:01:11] Well, in this season of gratitude and of Thanksgiving, many of us, we stop, we reflect, we take stock of our professional, our personal relationships, all the things happening in our life. And I love this time of year. I just want to say- and I don't love it for the gifts. I don't love it for the music. None of those things. I do love the holiday lights. I'll acknowledge that, it's one really fun and happy thing, but it just seems to be a perfect time of year to tell our colleagues, tell our clients why we appreciate them. So it becomes a question. I think that's what we're here to talk about most. Rob, you seem like you are the kind of person who so often expresses gratitude, which I really appreciate and receive from you well, every time you say thanks, it means something to me.
Rob Johnson [00:02:02] Well likewise. And I think that's one of the reasons we work so well together, whether it be here or in some of the projects that we do together professionally. It's because we respect one another and respect the fact that everybody's working hard, that everybody's busy and everybody's stretched thin, and I just always like to remind people, thank you for doing a good job, and that costs nothing. And we're going to get into that a little bit later. But I feel very strongly about that, thank you for saying that.
Eileen Rochford [00:02:26] You're really good at it. And, you know, there's some people who just stand out as the "great gratitude givers." You're definitely one of those people. Let's take your model of doing things really well and all the research we've done from other super smart people in this sector and come up with a nice little road map that our listeners can follow for expressing gratitude in a professional manner. I think that's what we're going to do.
Rob Johnson [00:02:52] Let's do it.
Eileen Rochford [00:02:54] Okay, so the first model - or example that we're going to draw from is an article that was in Forbes called Five Ways to Show Gratitude at Work. So I'll go through the list. A couple of them are more intriguing to me than others, but let's hear them all. The first is to write handwritten thank you notes to your employees or your colleagues. The second is to prepare a vision board for the year ahead and make gratitude a central part of that vision. Kind of intriguing. I've never done that before. The third is to practice a perspective shift. In other words, do your actions and your words match? Like do you feel gratitude a lot, but maybe you're not taking action to express it, that kind of thing. The fourth is to demonstrate your appreciation through action. And not just words, though words matter, and they're very important. But I understand the point there. And then the fifth is - I love this one. Avoid excuses for not practicing gratitude at work, because I bet we're all kind of guilty of that.
Rob Johnson [00:03:57] You know how much I appreciate what you're doing, and I'm sorry I never tell you. I'm just so busy and this and that and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. The thing is, you have the 5 to 10 to 15 seconds. And again, as I've already mentioned and as we'll mention again, it costs nothing. And it's very simple and it goes a long way. And when I'm on the giving end of that, it makes me feel good. And we'll talk about being on the giving or the receiving end. And when I'm on the receiving end, when I'm working with other people, whether it be you or some of the other groups that I partner with, having the boss say, "hey, really nice job, everyone. I appreciate it." You're like, "well, she didn't have to do that." And that matters.
Eileen Rochford [00:04:38] It does. You know, the avoiding excuses part is interesting because it is really easy to push this down to the bottom of your priority list when you've got a million things on top of taking 10 minutes to express thanks to someone who did a really good job for you when you have a pressing deadline. And in our situation, we're client service. So, you know, being inundated with requests from clients, which, you're always client first in an agency environment so you might neglect thanking the folks you work with. But it's something - I'll be really honest. I had to work really hard at this. It didn't come naturally to me.
Eileen Rochford [00:05:16] Like in general, I'm an actions-speak-louder-than-words kind of person by nature. And I always just felt like, "we're doing our job, we're all here to do that." Right? And I just kind of lost sight of how meaningful it is to say thank you. So for the person expressing the gratitude, it has lots of benefits. It's also really important for the receiver to get that kind of positive reinforcement and good feelings more frequently than not. So it's a skill that you do need to practice or cultivate, just like any other. And if - I think right now, because it's the time of gratitude and reflecting on the things we're thankful for, it's a great moment to start incorporating this and decide, "I'm going to make this a habit. I am. I'm going to work really hard, even if it's just once a week. If I haven't thanked someone in a meaningful way, then I didn't meet my goal." You know, dedicate like an hour on Friday or 30 minutes, really. Just make a point of demonstrating the gratitude to those who made a difference for you or made a difference to the team or made a difference to a project. Just say it. I had to do that. I had to schedule time and make it a thing that I held myself accountable for doing. And initially, that may have felt like a task to me, but that shifted very quickly and it became something I looked forward to because, really, it's fun.
Rob Johnson [00:06:42] You know, what I've built time in for and it's related to this. I started going through my contacts and just reaching out to various people in general and just saying, "Hey, how you doing? Just checking in. Want to see if you're okay." I didn't want anything. There was no ask behind it. There was no call to action. Nothing. Just, "how are you doing?" And then I also decided, you know, maybe on a weekly basis, trying to figure out the people that helped me that week and just drop them a, "Hey, thanks again for all the help this week. I really appreciate it." It might be a text and I know that you were just sitting here talking about various different ways to do it. Obviously, if you write a handwritten note, that's going to have a huge impact on people. Wow. You know, and I started writing more handwritten notes to people that have done nice things for me, hosted me in their home or things not related to this. And when I get one, I'm like, "Wow, I got a handwritten note." And I imagine that when people get one from me, that matters too. Having said that, that's a great way, and I'm glad you brought the handwritten note thing up because that shows an extra layer of attentiveness, I think. But just for me, because I text a lot without asking for anything, without, like I said, the call to action, I just would say, "hey, thank you for the help on this or help on that." You've done a nice job, this or that, and that's it. And it's one thing they might say, "Hey, thanks." They might not respond. It didn't matter. It wasn't about me doing it. It was about them receiving it. And people receive it, you know, sort of in different ways. But I just wanted them to know that I appreciated what they did.
Eileen Rochford [00:08:01] That's wonderful. You cultivated an action that in one way or another does express gratitude because acknowledging that you're thinking of someone and they came to mind for you and you just wanted to reach out; it's not overt, but it's kind of a subtle expression of appreciation. And I love that. Making it a habit. It's not easy to do so if you're not practicing gratitudes so frequently by expressing them at work, try scheduling it into your calendar and identify one or two people that you can write a nice note to or do something nice for. I mean, this Forbes magazine article said specifically show appreciation through action, not just words. So a few ideas. Let's share some ideas for actions that are really meaningful or I've seen mentioned in our research, and I just had lots of conversations in the last two weeks with everyone I was encountering to ask them a question, and some of those actions that came to mind, people mentioned things like, "Take the time to take a colleague out for a meal." How rare it is anymore that we do that with one another or for one another would make doing so exceptional. You're giving both your time and buying a meal, you know, and then you're also giving yourself the opportunity to get to know that person even better, which is really nice. And that helps at work too, right? So taking folks out for a meal was a good one that came up.
Rob Johnson [00:09:29] You know, another one that I want to jump in on is, and it's way simpler than going to dinner with somebody, although I think that's a terrific idea. It is, "Listen, you're doing great work for us and we want to increase your workload and give you more responsibility." Those are great words, aren't they? Doesn't it make you feel good if you heard that? But if you say that and then you don't do that, then people look at you sideways like, "Oh, is she going to do 50 other things that she has no intention or he has no intention of following through on?" The point about the action and the words as they have to match, "Hey, you're doing a great job on X projects and we're going to increase your responsibility, not just necessarily workload, but responsibility," and then you do it. If you're going to say you're going to do it, then do it. That is so easy. And if you're not going to increase their workload, if you're not going to give them more responsibility, then don't say anything.
Eileen Rochford [00:10:21] Hmm. Very good point.
Rob Johnson [00:10:24] And back to- because you've talked to a lot of people, back to your anecdotes with some of the folks you deal with.
Eileen Rochford [00:10:32] So another one that I've loved is offering to do a task that everyone finds boring, like take a turn or take a turn away from a colleague. Say they're up next and they might hate doing... I can't even think of an example right now. Maybe it's, you know, for us it's like, cleaning up the Drive. Of all the files that are out of date. Something like that. And saying, "You know, I'll do that because you did such an awesome job on this thing and it made everything easier for all of us. And you deserve a break. So I'm going to take your turn and I'm going to go do that this time." That's kind of a nice thing to do, and it costs you nothing but time and some effort. So if you're short on funds, that's a great way to do it. It's a nice gesture.
Rob Johnson [00:11:18] And the impact it has on everybody is undeniable.
Eileen Rochford [00:11:21] So, I came up with a couple nice ideas there as you're thinking about how you could incorporate this into your own work life. It doesn't have to be based on money. It can also be based on actions.
Rob Johnson [00:11:32] So I want to really quickly, because I want to combine two of the things you just brought up which were taking somebody to dinner- I just went to dinner last night with a former TV colleague of mine who really helped me out on a project I was working on for one of my clients. And it was like, "You really helped me out, and here are the five ways you really help me out." And I just wanted to show gratitude. And I took her to dinner. And when we were at dinner, she said, "You know what? Holidays are always a tough time in any business," especially if you work in my former business television where you have to work around the clock or on holidays, things of that nature. She's like, "You know, I'm going to take a couple of the holidays for people so they can have time off with their families." So I've seen other people do that before and it's very nice and they're like, "It's no big deal. I'm celebrating at this time or that," it's not going to keep me from, you know, having a good, meaningful time with my family. And I just thought, that is so nice. So that's cleaning up the hard drive. But it's also, you know.
Eileen Rochford [00:12:25] Yeah.
Rob Johnson [00:12:26] A lot of people were like, "yeah, you're going to work the 50th holiday in a row," and all of a sudden not having to do that and having somebody step forward who will then get to spend time at another time with their loved ones, that really made a big impact on me.
Eileen Rochford [00:12:40] Wow. What a great example. Wow. Stepping up. Now, if you're not traveling that year or whatever. That's a really nice gesture.
Rob Johnson [00:12:47] I was like, "Gosh, that was nice" and it's like, you know how it goes. I mean- everybody that's been in that business knows what it's like to have to work a holiday. And when you don't, it's like- if it's Christmas and you have to work holidays, (it's) like getting an extra gift. Or an extra three.
Eileen Rochford [00:13:01] I know. Oh, that's so nice. That really it's a meaningful expression right there.
Rob Johnson [00:13:06] I just want to talk about an article that we saw from Herzog University. It makes a pretty compelling case for this type of action because you're sitting there maybe listening to this and saying, "Okay, that's great, and that's- way to go. Nice, nice man and woman. You're thinking about others. Terrific." Well, this article notes that building and supporting your team has never been more important. And a key component of positive and successful work environments is showing gratitude to supervisors, employees and coworkers. As we're talking about here. However, and these numbers are fairly considerable here, 60% of employees seldom express gratitude at work. 74% rarely express thanks to their employer. And yet this same study shows that 81% of employees said a communicative manager would drive them to work harder. Just communicate, just show gratitude. Again for the third time. I know I've said it three times now. It costs nothing. It's just a more solid interpersonal relationship that you're building if you do that. So we wanted to tee this whole discussion up by giving you some of the numbers of what happens when people don't do it or what numbers of people aren't doing it. And based upon this article that I found, it's considerable. And so what if you were able to flip that script? What if you're able to become one of those people that express gratitude or in expressing thanks? And it's a two way street, too. It's like, "Thanks for the opportunity." Like, I gave you additional responsibility. You know, we put you on that project. It was a great opportunity for you. And you as the person that was put on the project, that made you feel great. You did great work. You might say thank you for the opportunity. I really appreciate it. So it's also a two way street.
Eileen Rochford [00:14:52] Yeah. So remember when we were young, you probably heard this expression a lot in school. "Kindness starts with me." Right? Well, think about that in the workplace. So when we express gratitude and make it kind of part of, you know, your culture and your DNA, all these things, expressing or being considerate, they increase in consideration, kindness, politeness, all of those things just tend to feed each other. And all of a sudden you have a very enjoyable workplace or even more enjoyable workplace than you may have before. And there's this reinforcement for everyone that isn't just about, "Oh, I love the work that I get to do here because I have such important clients," or it's, "What we're doing in terms of helping people is so meaningful." That's the work side. But on the how-do-I-feel-when-I'm-at-work side, gratitude plays a giant role in what your workplace environment is like.
Rob Johnson [00:16:00] This is a great point you're making. I mean, we're sitting here talking about one thing, but we've done something else here that's very, very important. It's how do I feel while I'm at work, while I'm doing the tasks at hand?
Eileen Rochford [00:16:10] Recently somebody had me read a lot of Anne Lamott. If you've ever read Anne Lamott, she talks about kindness and acceptance and all these different things that are really important to do and have realization and awareness of how it spreads goodness out into the world. So it's just been on my mind more so lately. And, you know, that kind of starts with me. It's almost trite, but I don't know. I may have rejected that for a few decades, but now I'm back. I'm back in the kindness-starts-with-me camp.
Rob Johnson [00:16:42] You mentioned it before, and I really like that you've kind of shared with us your personal- professional journey, I should say, about how you felt about this and how it was a natural for you and how you made it a part of what you do and who you are. And that's growth, that's personal and professional growth. And I'm not sitting here I'm not sitting here trying to give you a big ol, you know, 45 minute pat on the back. But those things matter. You're the, I mean, you've always been a great boss, but you've evolved in ways that maybe weren't always so natural to you. And this is what we're trying to convince other people to do. And here you are walking and talking this whole thing.
Eileen Rochford [00:17:20] I mean, you know, thank you. And I am trying, it's still something I got to hit myself upside the head. I've had to frequently say, "Wait a minute, slow down, stop building the to do list. You've got to stop and say thanks before you can think of more things we all got to do."
Rob Johnson [00:17:34] But, you know, we have all worked for that person that I referenced earlier, the hard driving, pedal to the metal win-at-all-cost, "Do your job, do your job!" boss.
Rob Johnson [00:17:44] Some people that are listening to this may still work for him or her, sadly.
Eileen Rochford [00:17:49] Yeah.
Rob Johnson [00:17:49] But the thing I think we're trying to convey here to our listeners is that those types of management philosophies are waning and being more thoughtful and being more present and being more, you know, open-eyed and open-eared is the way the executive world is going, I think. Don't you, Eileen?
Eileen Rochford [00:18:14] Absolutely. No doubt about it. Yeah, but it's kind of like the nicer people seem to be, you know, outweighing the bad more and more and more, and just nicer ways of being and acting are becoming more of the expectation versus just tolerating, you know, kind of whatever gets thrown at you.
Rob Johnson [00:18:34] Sure.
Eileen Rochford [00:18:35] All right. So I'm going to introduce a new little layer to this conversation, let's call it that. So because I'm really looking forward to my seven layer cake next week, so we'll call it a layer. So the idea that gratitude is good for you, I mean, I hope everyone is is hearing that more often and seen that more often. And the science behind why gratitude is good for you is becoming more and more clear. Just the top line. It it reduces stress. It builds wellbeing and resilience, which is fascinating to me. And it can even increase your patience. So we're not going to go into all of the whys of that. I just think it's a-
Rob Johnson [00:19:23] The builds resilience thing surprised me a little bit out of all those ones you just talked about. And but then if you take a step back and think about it, it really is applicable. It's really true.
Eileen Rochford [00:19:34] Yeah! It's like armor.
Rob Johnson [00:19:34] Those other ones I would have said, yep, it is good. Gratitude is good for you and for what reasons, you explained them all. But the resilience thing I guess made me take a second, you know, made me think twice. But it's true.
Eileen Rochford [00:19:46] Yeah, and it does. It is logical in a sense, because the more you're told thank you and you've done well and that was very important what you did for these reasons, the more that when the negative stuff comes along, you have the resilience to filter that out or to take the constructive kind of feedback aspect of whatever, you know, poorly conveyed negativism is sent your way. You're able to filter out something from that that's positive instead of having it just weigh you down and you're, you know, perseverating on it as this terrible thing that was said to you. You see what I mean? That's why I think resilience is built through gratitude or it's fostered.
Rob Johnson [00:20:34] But I think it's so important that you're bringing this up because we're not sitting here like two naive pups saying, "Oh, you should be have gratitude and everything's great, etc," because you just you just raised a very important point that sometimes the news at work isn't so good. Sometimes the reaction to work you've done or something you've done as an employee is not going to be taken so well by those in authority. And so it helps to be equal opportunity. It helps to be that person that's going around praising people that's saying that when you feel it, you know, in your heart or your mind, share it. Don't, don't keep it a secret, share it. Because there's going to be times where you're going to be delivering bad news or where are you going to be critical of the work somebody is doing. And you don't want to be, you know, for lack of a better term, "Johnny One note," the person that's always complaining, the person that's always, you know, criticizing. And I was like, "Oh, there's nothing I can do to make my boss happy." But if the boss is going around being equal opportunity, as I said, you just raised a really key point.
Eileen Rochford [00:21:37] Yeah, yeah. It's like an inoculation to a bad thing. So the patience piece, when I initially read that, I was like, "Really? Gratitude can increase patience, what?" and then I stopped and thought for a minute. So a few weeks ago I started seeing a therapist again. I hadn't been for a little while and she- and I love her. And she said she wanted me to do something every morning, literally, like, first thing is throwing your legs out of bed. Feet touch the ground, do this. It's the first thing you do. And I started doing it in the past, I don't know, 20 days. I have forgotten to do this a handful of times. But the vast majority I have remembered. And it's- start with when your feet are on the ground and you stand up. It's literally saying to yourself, "I'm grateful I can stand up today. I'm grateful I can take the five steps to the bathroom right now. I'm grateful I can see myself in the mirror because my vision's working." Like, think of every little thing that you would do in the first, like, 10 minutes of being awake, that you have the opportunity to acknowledge gratitude and the feelings of that thing being present in your life in a positive way.
Rob Johnson [00:22:53] And not everybody can do what you're talking about. I mean, for as basic as that is, in terms of a way to kind of live your life and to start your day. Not everybody can stand up. Not everybody can look at themselves in the mirror. And so it's not like, gosh, let's you know, we're not going to the lowest common denominator here. But if you break it down in those ways, everything else you do the rest of the day helps build that whole thing up.
Eileen Rochford [00:23:18] Yeah. And it's like you're building a house. Like, layers of good things upon good things, in a way, because that's what I've started to feel like from the small expressions first thing in the morning, you know, from the water that turns on in the tap and the medicine that I have, because I'm lucky to have a good doctor who diagnoses something, like that kind of stuff. Right? Acknowledging those moments. And then what I have seen is I have a lot better capacity for focusing and for being patient now in comparison to, you know, say three weeks ago or so. So it's just an interesting observation to share that being grateful and expressing it, whether it's to yourself. But I'd like to see us all do it to each other a little more.
Rob Johnson [00:24:01] It's also a different level of self-awareness, and that's where we all fall short as well. You know, not only do we not do it enough, with and to each other expressing those things, it's also the fact that some people are just not self-aware or they just don't care. And what you're forcing yourself to do is pulling your head out of the sand, as it were, and seeing what's right in front of you, because that's really what you're talking about, seeing what's right in front of you and then being grateful for what's right in front of you and to be able to express it in your own kind of way. But that's self awareness.
Eileen Rochford [00:24:33] Yeah. And it might be the first step that's easy is kind of if you're gonna look at this like building blocks, then, you know, maybe start expressing gratitude to yourself first. And then when you've made that a habit and incorporated it into your life in small ways, you can move on to making sure that you're taking the time to do it to others around you. You know, you don't have to try to do everything at once, as I would say.
Rob Johnson [00:24:53] No, I mean, the fact that you're doing it is what matters. There's something else here that I really appreciated about doing this particular episode, and that is that you tell everybody what you did in terms of the poll.
Eileen Rochford [00:25:04] Okay. So I don't think we've done this before.
Rob Johnson [00:25:08] We have not.
Eileen Rochford [00:25:08] Yeah, we conducted just a little poll on LinkedIn and we asked the following What is the best way to express gratitude at work? And we got a decent amount of responses. I was happy with it. And here's how it broke down. 50% said they would send a handwritten note.
Eileen Rochford [00:25:28] In contrast to 20% said they would share kudos in a team email. Also, a very nice thing to do, acknowledge people's contributions in a group setting. 14% said they would send a small thank you gift and another 14% had some kind of various answers in the comments. But things like, "I don't like to do any one thing. I like to mix it up." You know, depending on the situation, "Bigger accomplishments would warrant bigger thanks," was one comment that was made which- totally appreciate that. But 50% loved the handwritten notes. And I'll just say from my own experience, I think that I have kept nearly every handwritten thank you note I've ever been sent by a colleague or a client. And sometimes, when I'm cleaning out my office because you do that at least once a year, right, in a big way. So getting to that drawer where those thank you notes are kept is a moment of great pleasure because I never I never just move that box. I opened the box and I go and I read those things again. And it does make me feel really happy and just, it's a feeling of happiness. Just to recall, some of these people have retired long ago, you know, and just to recall how lovely it was to work with them, how they made me feel seeing their handwriting, you know, kind of brings back a flood of memories. I love the handwritten note. I really do. Now I have terrible handwriting and I hate writing with my hand because it's also not just illegible, but like physically it's taxing. And I'm a person who is, like, efficient to my core, as you all know.
Rob Johnson [00:27:14] Why don't you get your note taking AI to write the note?
Eileen Rochford [00:27:19] (Laughs) I know, right?
Rob Johnson [00:27:22] I mean it's like, "Is Eileen in this meeting right now?" And it's like having sometimes- and this is totally off subject. But (having) like, four Eileens, like I'm sure he's sitting there going, "How can I have more Eileen's?" So Eileen will pop into one of our weekly meetings that we have for a client. And this week it was like, "Oh, Eileen's AI is here. And I knew that Eileen wasn't there, but I knew her AI was." And so we had a little fun with that.
Rob Johnson [00:27:47] Eileen, your AI probably has better handwriting than you do? (laughs) You know, the way I interpreted this particular piece, because I answered the poll question and I would say, and maybe it goes back to the thing you were just talking about, which was when people said "How would I respond? It depends on how special it was." And so for me, the way I interpreted the poll was "What am I likely to do frequently," would I write a handwritten note? Yes, if I felt like something was really I mean, it was really, really special, I would probably write a handwritten note. And I have written handwritten notes as a sort of daily action. Am I going to write ten handwritten notes? No. Am I going to send a thank you email? And like I said, when I try to send them from time to time, I enjoy receiving those from clients, from bosses that say, "Hey, really nice job. I appreciate that." And so to me, in terms of something that was likely to be more common, which is to say I would, I mean I would write a handwritten note, but I don't do it frequently. I'm more likely to frequently send a thank you email, just, "Hey, thank you for all for what you all have done. I really appreciate it." And I feel like that's something that I can do pretty quickly and I think it conveys how I feel.
Eileen Rochford [00:29:11] Yeah, yeah. A fair point. One thing I'd like to do in November, I'm building on what you said about "I'm not going to do that every day," and I don't either, but I do take a moment in November. I have a pile of cards that I purchased two years ago, and it was like a block of like 200 cards and they're themed for fall gratitude, Thanksgiving and that kind of thing. And I sit down the week before Thanksgiving and I handwrite, even though my handwriting is legitimately awful and my hands cramp, I don't even know why. It's like, "How long has it been since I've written?" That's probably why. But I handwrite notes in those cards to clients with two of my closest and two colleagues, the people I work with and partners and I hand write a note. And then I mail it off and it's just kind of for me, it's like marks, "Hey, this is Thanksgiving week and this is something I'm doing." And during lockdown, COVID, darkness time in 2020 I expanded that to neighbors, like writing cards to neighbors and giving them, you know, just a little package of chocolates kind of a thing. Because I realized in lockdown how lucky we were to have those neighbors. So it's buying that kind of block of cards helped me make it a habit, and I formalized it in some way. Anyway, it's nice to do it occasionally, and I do try to incorporate that at a minimum that one time of year.
Rob Johnson [00:30:54] That's really good. Can I tell you one other quick story that my wife Stacey had us start doing it in the new year? We have this big glass cookie jar. She cut up these little pieces of paper and every Thursday we're supposed to write out what we're thankful for, we what we're grateful for. And then you fold it, throw it in there, and then probably early in the new year, we're going to read it. We've never done it before. It's not related to clients necessarily or this or that, but it was like that extra layer of thoughtfulness and being able to write down what you're thankful for. And so we're going to go back and review them, you know, in the New Year and say, "What will we thankful for?"
Eileen Rochford [00:31:28] Oh, that's so nice.
Rob Johnson [00:31:29] We date it, you know, like the date, every Thursday. I'll write one, she writes one, hold it up, toss it in the cookie jar. And plus it's paper instead of cookies going in a cookie jar. So it's good for your waistline, too.
Eileen Rochford [00:31:41] Isn't it, though? And it's good for your body or your brain.
Rob Johnson [00:31:46] You know, it's good for your soul.
Eileen Rochford [00:31:48] Yeah you nailed it.
Rob Johnson [00:31:50] So what we're talking about most of this discussion, this podcast has been doing this for altruistic reasons and that should be enough. But in the event that it isn't, why don't we talk about the financial reasons that this will help better your bottom line? In the book, leading with gratitude, the authors make the case for the impact of gratitude on employee performance, saying workers want and need to know their work is appreciated. Showing gratitude to employees is the easiest, fastest and most inexpensive way. Have you heard that before? To boost performance. The Forbes Coaches Council recently cited a study by the American Psychological Association where researchers found that 93% of employees who reported feeling valued said they are motivated to do their best work, and 88% reported feeling engaged. Among that group, only 21% plan to look for a new job in the coming year. And with employers being hypersensitive to losing employees and the cost associated with that, these numbers are significant. And if you can get 93% or 88% to agree on anything that is significant, and then when you talk about only 21% said, "Hey, I'm going to look for a new job." I mean, here's another reason. Here's a financial reason. An argument can be made for doing this. So I think just being a good boss and being a good person and showing people how you feel about them is good enough. But some people out there might say that's not good enough. Maybe this, these facts and figures we're sharing with you now will help make the case for that.
Eileen Rochford [00:33:27] Oh yeah. You have solidly convinced me that it works and it works on all kinds of levels. It helps the giver of the gratitude expression and helps the receiver. And now you just made the case that it helps the company, you know, by helping the culture. It's great. Yeah.
Rob Johnson [00:33:47] Yeah. So I mean, I think it's really important to note that as well. So I'm well aware of what we've talked about for most of this conversation. And I really believe every word that's come out of my mouth. And I'm sure you feel the same way, Eileen, but this last piece is sort of like the, "Hey, if that's not good enough for you, how about this?" Because those numbers are significant, as I mentioned.
Eileen Rochford [00:34:11] So there's a couple of things I think we could cover off and on as we close a little bit of like the how, we've done a ton of the why for sure, but maybe a little bit of the how. All right. So I read this in- well, I'll start with this. So in a number of places I saw mention that a good way to formalize this is by establishing a channel like if you use a messenger or a chat tool like Slack, we use Slack. Having a channel on Slack for expressing gratitude and you know, acknowledging somebody did a really good job, it's an open forum, all of us can contribute to it. So we've had that for quite a while at the Harbinger Group. It's one of my favorite channels and you know, it's very existence helps remind me, on those Friday moments, "Did you do one of those this week Eileen? if you haven't in a while, well, get on there and say something great." We call ours You Rock. That's the name of our channel on Slack. You Rock because you did that great thing. And here's all the ways that you're great. I think that's important. Also, I try to find these random moments to just send gift cards like Starbucks. You know, "Here's your eGift of ten bucks. Just go get your coffee today. It's on me because you're awesome. And you did this thing that really, really helped us out. And you always come through for us. You're so reliable, responsible, etc., etc.." We did one recently, so I just asked, "Hey, is everybody voting today?" You know, voting is a protected right in terms of paid time off here in the city of Chicago. So I just asked folks, "Hey, you know, did you vote?" It has nothing to do with who'd you vote for, don't care. I want to know you did it.
Rob Johnson [00:36:04] Just do it.
Eileen Rochford [00:36:05] So and to everyone who sent in their fun pictures of them at the polling place or showed their sticker or whatever, I just sent them a Starbucks card. You know, "Thanks for voting. You're awesome." It doesn't always have to be work related, I guess is the point that I'm trying to make. Even though they are your coworkers.
Rob Johnson [00:36:24] This is a great idea.
Rob Johnson [00:36:25] The whole thing about civic activism, it's like, "I don't care who you vote for. I just care that you went and voted because we talk about this in our society all the time and there's plenty of places around the world that can't do it." You people say, "I don't believe in that." It's like, "Listen, if you want to effect change, if you don't like the way things are going, then the only way you really have a voice is by doing that." So I think it is not related to work, but it's related to fostering what a work culture of support.
Eileen Rochford [00:36:55] I like that. So there are a few more things in the Harvard Business Review piece that I'm going to put in the shownotes. So all you guys can keep an eye out for that in the show notes and that I want to cover now. So when you are expressing your gratitude, there's a couple of ways to do it better than others, and I'll explain. So first, be specific, explain what you're grateful for. Why it meant a lot to you. But mostly tell them why you appreciate them. The person, not just what they did. And try not to focus solely on how it helped you. The person writing the note. Try to keep the focus on them. That's that's something that a couple of behavioral psychologists went into.
Rob Johnson [00:37:41] Great piece of advice always.
Eileen Rochford [00:37:42] Yeah, I was appreciative when I read that, too. So I'm going to be reframing my gratitude in the near future to model that. The article also advised to really try to do it in the moment or shortly thereafter. Just don't wait. You're going to forget, first of all. Right? And what was one of the things we said at the top of this? Stop creating excuses for why you're not expressing gratitude. So doing it in the moment helps you not forget. It also means more to the person because they may be sitting there thinking, "Gosh, nobody even said anything about that great thing I did, that really bums me out." So you're allowing some kind of negativity to enter when really what they should be hearing and feeling is good things. And then this last one, and I appreciated this too. Don't overdo it. As in, you risk diluting the meaning of your thanks or gratitude if you kind of make it a default and you're doing it all the time and it's just and maybe you're repeating the same words even, you know, you got to be conscious of that.
Rob Johnson [00:38:51] And it's great to be thankful, but at the same time, maybe not every little task that you perform is worthy of a, "Thank you for doing that."
Eileen Rochford [00:39:00] Yeah.
Rob Johnson [00:39:00] You know what I mean? So I, I'm totally on board with that one.
Eileen Rochford [00:39:04] I had this client, it was long ago and she's long retired who always finished everything to every single person, whether it was, you know, email writing or on phone calls with just, Thank you, thank you, thank you so, so much!" And, I don't know. After a while it just became, "Yeah, I get it." So I see the point that, you know, don't do it every single day or else the meaning of it's going to wear off pretty quick.
Rob Johnson [00:39:31] Yeah, that makes perfect sense.
Eileen Rochford [00:39:34] So I will link that in our show notes, as I said. But hopefully in this awesome season of gratitude and thankfulness, we've inspired you to think about how you can express it not just right now, but now is a great time to start a habit! But always to your colleagues and your clients. And you can think about, you know, in the next 30 days, "What can I do to be grateful and kind of mark for those who are important to me that I have this gratitude and appreciation for them."
Rob Johnson [00:40:09] That's great advice and that's a great way to end it with the sort of actionable, "How can I do this?" And I think you've sort of teed everybody up that is thinking about doing this to make it pretty simple, and that's very easily understood.
Eileen Rochford [00:40:24] Well, I am grateful for you. Rob Johnson, thank you for being my partner on the show!
Rob Johnson [00:40:28] And I am grateful for you. It's been just a wonderful journey working with you on various projects, working with you on this one. I just enjoy every minute.
Eileen Rochford [00:40:37] Well, thank you. I appreciate you immensely. And I guess that's going to do it for another episode of Can You Hear Me? I'm Eileen Rochford.
Rob Johnson [00:40:45] And I'm Rob Johnson. As always, thank you for listening. And don't forget that you can find can you hear me wherever you get your podcasts, Apple, Spotify, Google Podcasts and more. And we'll be back in a couple of weeks, but have a great holiday season.